alfreda89 | I almost made this private, but....

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I almost made this private, but....

I'm sorry, but I just have a problem with this. Who is raising these children? I know friends who struggle to give three children enough attention, and I have a cousin who is sweating how much she can aid her four children to get educated for the work world.

If it was their eighth, I'd think, okay, that's excessive, but if you're into big families, there you are. But 16? You'd think they came from a society where children have to take care of them in their declining years, so there's no retirement fund.

I sure hope he's one of those real estate agents who makes $1 mil a year. If they can afford this, okay--but it's just feels irresponsible, somehow.

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Three things I noticed.

One, the "J" names... geez.

Two, most of them are very biblical names.

Three, they seem to think it's God sending them children instead of, oh, you know, sex. Yeah, God will send ya' kids until you wear out, no problem there.

Yeah, God will send ya' kids until you wear out, no problem there.

It was horrible to think it without knowing these people, but it did occur to me that this poor woman may have to sit down the rest of her life--her uterus probably looks like a war took place, it could slide right out.

And he can always find another wife, if this one wears out. It's traditional....

Jim Bob? The dad's name is Jim Bob?
This brings back memories of Walton's Mountain.

Sounds like he can afford to provide so far be it for me to object. Still, I have to wonder about why they'd choose to have so many children. Most of us have our hands full with far fewer children.

Maybe they can afford to hire help. With a 7,000 sq. foot house in the plans, I certainly hope so.

Maybe they can afford to hire help. With a 7,000 sq. foot house in the plans, I certainly hope so.

That's my guess--she's GOT to have at least one nanny.... Or religious boarding schools for the older ones.

Obviously, it's the life they want to live, and they like it. Just my own envy showing--my ex didn't want any, and I stayed with him so long, it's too late to have any with anyone else.

homeschooled

Definitely a solution--her family is her job, as it was for our great-grandmothers.

I watched a discovery channel special on them from just before their 15th child was born, and the way they do things in a "buddy system." Each of the older children has a buddy from the younger bunch - the older buddy helps the younger one with getting dressed, getting coats on before leaving the house, etc. Essentially, the older children are raising the younger ones.

I believe that the mother home-schools all the children, and nurses each baby as they come along. They make most of their own clothes (at least for the girls) and they are building their own house (the one described in that article).

I believe they are a branch of Mormon, though I could be mistaken on that. (They are very religious, in any event.) They have a couple other families that meet with them for worship services, and the other families are not-quite-but-almost as big as the Duggers.

One thing that I did find interesting with this family is that they have no debt whatsoever. When the parents originally got married, they paid off all their debt and determined never to have any debt again - now they pay cash, don't buy it if they don't have the entire price available now, etc.

I believe the father is a politician of some variety.

I would have guessed at the buddy system--it can work out quite well, if all the kids get on board with it. If they're doing this on cash, they have my admiration. I live that way, and sometimes it's not easy--but in the end, I think it's better.

Actually, my family grew up exactly this way (five kids, my parents were also Mormon before they converted to Atheism). I'm a huge fan of it, and I'd actually bet that the kids in that family feel more loved and paid attention to than many kids in much smaller families.

A high-school friend who is now an ultra-orthodox Jew once commented, amused, that many of her friends have families larger than my Girl Scout troop. (Which at the time had ... 8 girls, I think.)

I have obviously been an SF/mystery writer and reader too long. My first thought was, the ultra-conservative Jews, Muslims and Christians are all going to go at each other with BIIIIIIIIIIG sticks...last one standing is the winner.

Good grief. When I was growing up, we knew one family with eight kids and one with ten--both Irish Catholic. Most Jewish families had 2-3 kids...

Depends on the "denomination," essentially--chasidic/lubavitch/ultraorthodox if very different from reform, conservative, or even modern orthodox in this regard.

My knowledge of the chasidic groups is limited to the books THE CHOSEN and THE PROMISE. But there is a certain sense in this. I wish I could find the site I stumbled into once--a professor who has spent his private life's research in showing how climate effected societies and led to the patriarchal form of religion/culture...

He had some interesting stuff on his site. And he had a real degree, from a well-known school. Must find him again in my copious free time...

In many ways, the chasadim are the fundamentalists of Judaism. (But not all. For one thing, sex, while it has laws governing it--as everything does--is not considered in any way evil, and one is fully expected to enjoy it.)

An easier yoke than some!

Also, arguably, women, while restricted (but so are men) have more power than they would in fundamentalist Christian or Islamic sects.

Another improvement on the other versions. Perhaps because they have been a people so long, the men know what goes wrong when the women have no say?

Can you imagine being a man in such a group, and never meeting your bride until the wedding--your parents arrange it to their satisfaction--and then you find out that, worse than ugly or mean, she's STUPID?! And is going to give you stupid kids?

I fear I would either have not lasted long, or become She-Who-Must-Be-Obeyed...

the older siblings are rasing the children.

I think you're right--an elderly friend of mine told me it always used to be that way--her mother actually had a nervous breakdown at one point and went to bed for two years. The kids took care of the house and each other until Mom recovered from working her self to death and got up again.

Of course, a lot of those big sisters probably were in no hurry to have kids, having already raised a family.

Of course, a lot of those big sisters probably were in no hurry to have kids, having already raised a family.

Heh... that's not necessarily true, having helped raise my little sister I was fanatical to have kids of my own as soon as I could, and all my siblings are excited to be parents as well. I think exposing kids to birth and child-raising at a young age can be very good for their future parenting skills.

As far as overpopulation goes, well, that's a whole 'nother story. :)

I think it has a lot to do with personality--if you're a nurturing type, this system would be great for you. If you're not, you'd never felt like you had any time for private thinking, etc. You then might be catching up as an artist, etc. for a few years before starting a family...

"...a former state representative..."

"...who sells real estate, previously lost his bid for the U.S. Senate. He said he expects to run for the state Senate next year but isn't ready to make a formal announcement."

(But the snide comment in me wants to add "...but on the lighter side, the couple is expected to graduate High School next month..." but that's really not fair in this case.)

Someone else mentioned they live on a cash system only. I may not want to live like they are, but they're apparently paying for their children and their lives--so I can't throw stones. If they can afford them, then there you are.

Mel Gibson has six or seven--but they want them, and can afford them. And his religious ideas probably are crazier than this couples'....

I think it's irresponsible from a global population perspective (but then, I'm uneasy with more than one or two biological children for the same reason), but I gather the dynamics of how you raise kids changes when you have that many--older ones helping with younger ones, that sort of thing. And given the house they're building (does a household of 18 really need nine bathrooms, even if some of them are teens?) it looks at least like they have the finances together.

I wonder how the kids feel about it?

I wonder how the kids feel about it?

So do I. Do they feel special and lucky, or do they long to try living alone, or in a smaller group?

If they're really paying as they go, then there's not much to say to them. Although I have that same global itch in the back of my head...

Apparently the mother nurses the newest for six months or so, then hands it off to a "buddy" sibling who becomes responsible for looking after the child. Yeah, that's healthy. The scary part is that the daughters have said that they want to become walking baby machines, too. Brrr.

The scary part is that the daughters have said that they want to become walking baby machines, too. Brrr.

Perhaps they have no other gifts to give to the world.

Perhaps they'll never have a chance to find out.

Try two to post.

With a 7,000 sq. foot home, I guess they can afford the kids and can afford to hire the kind of help (housekeepers, mother's helpers, gardners, etc.) that most of us can't. Still, I have a hard time imagining keeping up with that many children. Just scheduling the soccer games would be traumatic. Which child's school event do you attend?

Someone mentioned that she home schools them. I doubt they have any activities that aren't family or church based.

When I think how hard it is to juggle a dozen or more friends, the mind boggles at juggling 16 kids--and a spouse.

kids can do housework - at least the girls can

kids can do housework - at least the girls can

The best parents teach their sons to do as well--then they know how to do it, if they ever need the info... An old boyfriend knew more about doing laundry than I did, at first.

hmmm.. you really belive I believe only girls can do house work........

hmmm.. you really belive I believe only girls can do house work........

Not at all. I'm confident you're a troublemaker, and you deserve all the mischief your crew is going to get into in the coming years... '^)

With the mention of "the Lord" and the Biblical names, you can venture a guess there's no notion of birth control in this probably fundamentalist family....

Hmmm.

I'm sure they figure that when God wants them to stop increasing, the babies will stop arriving.

Of course, the longer you have them, the longer you can have them, or so they used to say.

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